Flashback Friday: Phil Boyce Fires Bob Grant

Radio Ink Magazine turns 25 in 2017. In every issue of the magazine we’ll be looking back at some of our best issues, greatest quotes and top interviews. Every Friday, here at Radioink.com we’ll also be taking a cool look through the Radio Ink time machine. Back in 2003 we interviewed Programming guru Phil Boyce (who is now with Salem). Boyce was working at WABC in New York City. He had just moved to WABC from WJR in Detroit to replace John Mainelli. His task — to “blow up the station.” Here’s an excerpt from our 2003 interview….

Radio Ink: When you arrived at WABC in 1995, you had to take it apart and start from scratch. Were you ready for that?
Boyce: No. I was not fully prepared for what I was walking into. I think I was a good PD, but I didn’t come to WABC with the idea of blowing it up and starting over. I came here wanting to keep it on top. The problem was that there were some internal problems at the station that caused the foundation to crack. There were some things really wrong with the station and we had to fix them. If I had known the task ahead when I took the job I probably would have stayed in Detroit. As it was, I still had panic attacks for several months after I took this job, wondering if I was good enough to handle it- and that was before I had to blow it up and start over.

Radio Ink: How would you describe the problems you faced?
Boyce: There was a programming problem and a sales problem. WABC had been a Talk station since 1982, and from a ratings standpoint, it was very successful. It was the most listened to Talk station in the nation; it was ranked roughly No. 5 in New York and the No. 1 AM station in New York City. But the station had lost money every one of those years since 1982. To be fair, it was close to making a profit and was probably going to turn around anyway, but there was a negative halo over the station, hurting it from a sales standpoint and making it difficult to convince advertisers that this was legitimate Radio Station. WABC was seen as a negative, kind of right-wing wacko, maybe even slightly racist. I don’t know that it was racist, but there were certainly things said on the station that were difficult for the company to defend.

Radio Ink: Bob Grant being the primary offender?
Boyce: Well, it was just maybe four months before I got here that our afternoon host was on the cover of New York magazine, wrapped in a red WABC banner with a big headline that was embarrassing to the station. We had to do something, but I was here about a year before we made the decision to blow it up. It was the most difficult and stressful things I have ever encountered, yet perhaps the biggest challenge and biggest potential success of my career. And I remember thinking, “if I can rebuild this Radio station, I’m in hero county.”

Radio Ink: So you cleaned house a little.
Boyce: Yes. We fired Bob Grant and a night host who was similar to him at that time. I have to say, Bob is a great Talk show host, and he worked very well with me for that year. I had to teach Bob how to tone it down; and in Bob’s defense, I don’t think anyone had ever done that with him. He had been encouraged to do some things that eventually came back to haunt him. The die was cast, and one little slip up was going to result in his being fired- there were no more second chances. When we made that decision, it was spring of 1996, right in the middle of the spring book. I knew it would take five years to rebuild the station, but I didn’t know that I’d have five years, because in this day and age when they want quick turn-around, who’s going to give PD five years? So I kept that to myself. I never told anybody “Hey, this is going to take us five years.”

Radio Ink: How long did it take?
Boyce: Ironically, it was kind of prophetic, because five years to the book after that happened-in the spring of 2001-we once again were the most-listened to Talk station in the nation, we were No. 5 in New York, and No.1 on the AM band. But it wasn’t until that day that I really thought we could do it. Actually, I knew we could do it: I just didn’t know how much time it would take.

Boyce went on to say that one of the defining moments for WABC was bringing on Sean Hannity, “perhaps the most important decision.” Boyce added, “I’ve never met anybody in this business more driven to succeed. And the truly nice thing about Sean is that he is a great guy”

Bob Grant passed away in 2014 at the age of 84

Phil Boyce is now the SVP/Spoken Word Format for Salem Media Group and Salem Radio Network and can be reached at [email protected]